From lists@galileo.math.siu.edu Mon Jan 3 12:01:48 2000 Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2000 11:59:18 -0600 (CST) From: Mike Sullivan Reply-To: Mike Sullivan To: FACULTY_SENATE-L Discussion List Subject: Re: More Dialog In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: On Mon, 3 Jan 2000, Dick Coulson wrote: > To this discussion (perhaps dialog is better) between Mike and Terry > I would like to add some comments. > > Regarding attendance in scheduled lectures I don't think, in most > circumstances, it should be necessary for students to attend class. With all due respect, you teach bright highly motivated students. We "in the trenches" are dealing with a different segment of the population. Many basic math courses (calculus, linear algebra, etc) have pass rates below 50%. I have never had a student get an A who did not attend class regularly. This includes students I taught at UT Austin and Northwestern. Math lectures are primarily problem solving sessions. The students need to see how I think when I tackle a problem. You really cannot get that from books alone. We are under pressure to improve our pass rates (as we should be). But there is a lot of tension over how to do this. The easy way is to lower standards. If I thought SIU students where genetically inferior to say UIUC students, I would lower my standards. But I do not think they are. I think they need more help to make up for poor high school preparation (which may due to their own immaturity or may be do to racist funding schemes or many other factors). They also have serious financial hardships. My Northwestern students took four courses a quarter, had a week off for study before finals, and did not have to work. I see SIU, and schools like it, as a second chance for many students. But I do not believe they deserve a second rate education, since I do not believe they are second class citizens. Of course, they do have the option of pursuing a vocational education in the many fine programs in ASA and elsewhere. But if they want a BS in EE or CS we ought to give them the real thing. Mike Sullivan Math SIUC